smith and wesson model 19 classic problems

I CARRIED A 4 NICKEL AS A ROOKIE IN 1974, AND WHEN I WENT TO VICE/NARCTICS A 2 1/2 ONE. Ive owned and let go of (through trades and whatnot) more K-Frame revolvers than I care to disclose. Can you imagine what given the huge jump in tech of bullet construction a 110-125gr full house max psi load would do by the old loading standards. And as far as the forcing cones are concerned, Ive never found out why S&W forcing cones on K-frames erode so much with magnum loads, and yet the cones of similar size in Ruger Security-Sixes dont. Still they were/are wonderful feeling guns. No speed loaders, no trigger pull gage, no full power loads, and no 4 barrel which is the length everyone carried back in the day when the Model 19 (and Model 66) was the preferred duty revolver for many in law enforcement. model 19, I took my brand new S&W model 19 Classic to the range today to fire for the first time and I had a significant issue. Let the new gun owners have their space in time. Great revolvers! The variety in Smith & Wesson's catalog has only increased throughout the years from the little all steel Model 36 and 60 to the latest alloy framed lightweights like the 637 and 642. Thanks RobC, I actually have one available at the shop, but ultimately, I find little use in them. An object in motion tends to stay in motion; once it starts, the big .44 caliber cyclinder wants to keep on spinning. It is a beautiful paperweight, though. No tool marks or poor fitting, but no embellishments either. My dad was a right handed shooter, and routinely carried his duty revolver on his left side, with the butt of the gun facing forward, so he could easily Cross Draw for just that reason. The best thing to be done is make the cylinder gap as tight as possible, so as to limit how much heated gas can escape the gap. The leeching problem occurs even in stainless, but in each type of steel, thousands of rounds must be fired. The only candidates to replace my 19 are heavier framed revolvers in the same caliber from the S&W Performance Center. All accuracy testing was conducted at 25 yards with the revolver mounted in a Ransom Rest. Because of the Model 19shistory and my love of wheel guns, I spent a few nights practicing my draw, dry fire and reload drills. This revolver features rubber grips and is offered with a 2.75-inch barrel, as well as the standard 4.25-inch barrel. But for serious business, lots of times we wished for something a little stouter. [emailprotected] [emailprotected] from 6 barrel ouch!! Specifications: Smith and Wesson Model 19 Combat Magnum, Barrel Length: 6 (others available) Ive been told the weakness issue at the forcing cone was rectified with the introduction of the 19-4. I freely admit that this is where I am weakest, especially when I shoot while walking backwards. S&W Model 19 Classic Specifications. Sounds like you pulled out all the stops for a comprehensive review Jon. The Smith and Wesson Combat Magnum is alive and well. S&W Model 19 Classic .357 Magnum "Combat Master Reborn"!Re-Introduced after 19 years, the Classic has upgraded features but still keeps the Spirit of the ear. It is a sleek, good looking, pistol with great lines and a blue finish. Le/Mil Only. When everything is a game of compromises, the Model 19 was the first revolver to win that game, measuring weight against caliber in a perfect blend. I bought one in 1980 and it had a 3.5 ounces trigger. Second department we used .357 that were 125gr. But you can find commercial loads like those from Atlanta Arms example 9mm 115 HAP match ammo. so check Salt N Pepa Jacket which is a most selling outfit in our store, Shop now and get amazing discounts and offers. The medium-size double-action revolver was first produced in 1896 in .32 S&W Long. Accelerating the big .44 cylinder from a stop takes much more energy than the svelte cylinder on the model 19. I find the Smith N frames for duty weapons to be over sized, to heavy and harder to conceal when in plain clothes. Still, I normally practice with 38 spl, but often run a cylinder (or 2) of 357 just to keep me honest. In 1955 the .357 Magnum version was first offered. Poor choice of words? Well, the blued Model 19 is back, and it has some new style. I DO realize theres some cost savings, but is it really worth it? Its just about perfect for personal protection, and it makes a darn good trail gun, too. The results of my accuracy shooting session with the new Model 19 Classic with a total of 10 factory loads (five .357 Magnum loads and five .38 Special loads) are listed in the accompanying chart. Please log in again. Nice revolver and well written article, but until S&W gets rid of the wart on the side, the so called safety, Ill pass. Id love to try a diamond back someday.i bet id like it. Reliability * * * * * Clearly, Im no Jerry Miculek. Ill be checking out the best deal on the new 19 for sure! Yes sir. What I do know is that its difficult to find 9mm +P in any sporting goods store or gun store, period. These loads are not for the faint of heart. The .357 definitely benefits from room to run, even more so in a lever gun. But if you know what you want, shop around. I have several S&W revolvers now, but damn, would I like to have that one back. Hope this area was strengthened in the new model? Ive heard similar statements in the TTAG comment section and it seems to be a popular myth running around many forums. I guess that depends if you just shoot a few hundred rounds per week, or you go for the gusto with 5000 rounds per month! Get the top Shooting Times stories delivered right to your inbox. Unlike the original Model 19, the new Model 19 Classic has a two-piece barrel setup. Its failure due to the lock would not get me killed. Hellstrom was the president of S&W at the time, and Jordan was famous for many reasons, including serving in the U.S. Border Patrol for 29 years and then touring the country for 11 years as a spokesman for the NRA, during which he performed trick-shooting exhibitions. This brings the DA pull down to 9 pounds, and the trigger pull becomes much smoother. That seems OK when I measure it with a feeler gauge. Ships To Store. In my mind, the best revolver ever manufactured up until current date you rarely ever saw a Colt on the firing line in the hands of any shooter, even just Master class, or higher. The factory spec for trigger pulls on S&Ws is about 2.75 lbs for single-action mode, about 12 lbs for DA mode. IF I had a Model 19 Id carry either .38 SPL Meat Mashers like I do now or way loaded down .357 with the same bullets. I see these S&W wheel guns and it all comes back from my impressionable youth, One Adam-12, One Adam-12, see the man.. In 1955, Smith & Wesson introduced the .357 Combat Magnum which would become the Model 19 two years later when the company went to a model-numbering system. Three years later it was chambered for .38 Special. Behind-the-Scenes at SIGs Electro-Optics Factory, Speer Gold Dot .38 Special +P 125 gr. I dont think I will buy one of the new models however. $26.00. And a small, light cylinder would weigh less and turn easier when you pulled the trigger double action. Buy and Sell on GunsAmerica! A high quality .357 Magnum revolver with a 5-inch barrel (starts daydreaming about it). 244.99 . The trigger itself, however, is clearly superior on the older Model 19.. The reason I switched to the S&W revolver is accuracy. The Model 19 is great for those just learning to shoot a revolver, as well as for a daily carry, personal defense pistol. Still, it took some getting used to. Fire shots more accurately with a Smith & Wesson revolver. GDHP. Stainless steel contains chromium, which resists the leeching, and this makes stainless a better gun steel, in my opinion. It will all sound plausible to a gun ignorant jury. Aside from that blunder, Id also wager that he did better at home economics than physics in high school. Heres what he told Hellstrom, in his own words: To begin with, it ought to be a .357 Magnum. The thinner stocks, combined with the tapered profile, caused the pistol, with stout loads, to ride up in the hand. A similar situation exists with .44 special in a .44 magnum revolver. The question is: will enough wannabe revolver buyers want a new Model 19 and not care about the Hillary Hole to make it an ongoing success? Makes the older mint ones a bargain at $800-$1000. I always saw those as more for city kids that grew up without guns at home, or who didnt carry and hunt with them almost all year round, like we did. If Colts had ever proved to be either more accurate or possessing a better double action trigger pull, it would have been those revolvers dominating PPC, not Smiths. Smith & Wesson is merely trying to make their revolvers be accepting to the widest audience possible, but honestly, that is an eye-sore. Kimber K6S Stainless .357 Mag 2 Barrel 6-Rounds . Shooting from a leather holster I use for my seven-inch Ruger Bisley Blackhawk, my best draw and fire of one round into an eight-inch circle at 15 yards was 1.36 seconds. 3 bids. The most accurate .357 Magnum load was the Winchester 125-grain Defender ammo. Rather than shoot .38 special, I would rather shoot .357 loaded down to .38 velocities. It's based on the N frame, larger and now with an eight-round cylinder instead of the six of the 19 and earlier N frames. The most common issues with the Smith & Wesson Model 41 are the failure to fire, the failure to extract, the failure to eject, the slide issue, the locked gun issue, the magazine issue, and the dryfiring issue. The first thing you notice is the grip. I also fired it offhand, using my regular self-defense practice drills. You could also just grind down the cam on the lock arm. Possible causes include the use of ammunition that is incompatible with the revolver. After a couple years of qualifying with the .357s the M-66s started to shake loose. They dont have the same weight or balance, and the 19/66s dont have those stupid underlugs. Make no mistake, the recoil is very stout! The only Smith I will own with a lock would be a .22 caliber, because I would never carry it for self-defense. I still love all of the Smith K frames and the L frames are a close second. Even with a six-inch barrel, the gun draws well and points even better. The Model 19/66 also was one of the finest guns ever made. My slow times were simply due to the triggers cycle time. If you have a M19, then you gotta get a M27. I may want to re-think this logic during Archery season though. The new Model 19 is also offered in a stainless steel version outside the Classic line. My best draw and fire of six shots into the same circle at 15 yards was 4.17 seconds. There seems to be a problem serving the request at this time. To our rather jaded eyes, the traditional Masterpiece guns, without the under-lug, are how a Smith & Wesson revolver should look and the Classic is Smith & Wesson Performance Center Model 19 Carry comp, .357 Mag. While some may object to the MIM (Metal Injection Molding) parts, there is nothing wrong with them from a functional standpoint. He was about to appear on a television show called You Asked for It, during which he would perform a fast-drawing act he was famous for. And it certainly outclasses any of the common modern service pistols in fit and finish. Now both the P09 and VP9 are capable of 1 groups @ 25 but no way do they run sub 2 with a bunch of various SD or other loads. Part of that is due to the barrel length, but that grip plays a big part in double action fast (fastish?) In 1970 stainless steel was offered, and in that form it was called the Model 66. Despite plenty of time on the range and a lotof time dry firing, I still cant shoot this gun fast. Free shipping on many items | Browse your favorite brands | affordable prices. I hope there are some gunleather fans on here! I guess, I think Ill somehow get into a 34 round gunfight someday. You might expect that the longer times, such as a .4 split time, were because of the recoil of the gun. I, tried tah o ce myself when I was a Boss for the first time. Daily carry requires a good holster. The little K frames are just about perfect for Law Enforcement use. Jordan asked. Hilary Hole. Smith & Wesson Model 19 Classic, 4.25" Barrel, 357 Magnum, Blued . Mostly Glocks. As much as I love the S&W 686 revolvers, they just arent 19/66s. As American forces fought in the Philippines, US troops made an unfortunate discovery about the performance of their standard-issue revolvers chambered in .38 Long Colt. Only pre mim.pre Hillary hole smiths for me. 0 bids. Firearm Specifications SKU: 12040 Model: Model 19 Classic Caliber: 357 Magnum 38 S&W SPECIAL P Capacity: 6 SKU: 12039. The weight makes up for the 4.0-inch length. But in all fairness, you need to compare that snubby to a 3 or shorter 9 mm. A very good finish, but no deep pools of gleaming blue. He obviously doesnt realize that the cylinder comes to a complete stop when the hammer is falling and stays that way until the noise happens and the bullet is long gone. They are obviously target stocks on both guns. With only 60 rounds? View. Style * * * * Kudos to the gunsmiths making the sweet old guns even sweeter. In fast fire I had to learn to feel for it, but it certainly lets you know right before the hammer falls. All the way out to 100 yards, they are only 3.6 apart, if the gun is zeroed at 25 yards. The only reliable gun safety is between the shooters ears. And as youve said before, the .357 has a bit more powder capacity than the 10mm. loads are not +p but just standard full pressure loads which every revolver is proofed to 130%. I agree with JWT regarding barrel length and DG regarding quality. To me, it's a case of "you don't get a stupid lock, it's made in a period of better quality control and manufacturing, and it's less money." As far as my high school pistol team, no we did not have one. Estimated New and Used Values for a Smith & Wesson Model 19 Values are based on a basic model with no options or colors. If it functions OK unloaded, the problem is most likely powder residue glued to a chamber wall with factory lubrisludge. No Smith with Hillary Hole for me. I've owned five Smith revolvers bought used; zero bought new. You can remove the silly lock, and replace it with a lock delete so there is no hole for junk to go in. Joseph Von Benedikt visits with Aaron Oelger from Hodgdon about the unprecedented demand on the shooting supply industry. Theres just no comparison. The triggers fingerpiece is smooth and measures 0.38 inch wide. The Smith & Wesson Model 19 "Combat Magnum" was one of the most beloved handguns ever made. If youre talking about most commercial loads in a very short-barreled revolver, like a 2 1/2 snubby, this statement is true. Be patient and look for a nice example of both, and hang onto them. In the meantime, give the Model 19 Classic a look. We are all showing our age here when complaining about the Hillary Hole, MIM parts, shrouded barrels. Two-handed, it gave me plenty of real estate for an absolutely rock-solid hold on the mid-framed Magnum. I carried it until I bought a 686 when it came out. Like many revolvers of the era, the Model 25 can load six rounds of .45 Colt. The 2.5-inch-barreled guns were offered with only the round butt, whereas the 4.0-inch-barreled guns and the 6.0-inch-barreled guns were offered with square butts. My plan was to cut this revolver neophyte some slack until I got to this part: My slow times were simply due to the triggers cycle time. Yet the 9mm they have allowed to creep up more and more trying to get this cartridge to a decent level. Model 15s, 13s, 19s, 586s, 27s, 28s and 29s. Smith & Wesson Model 19 with 4 inch barrel - .357 Magnum BuyItNow! Over the decades that this revolver was produced, many different variations came fromthe S&W factory. I should mention that S&W brought back the stainless-steel Combat Magnum, known as the Model 66, in 2017, and it, too, had the newer two-piece barrel design. 5 more deals from grabagun.com . Failure to fire twice. The .357 still has an edge but not by much. Hands-On Review of the Smith & Wesson Equalizer, Savage Arms Introduces Iconic 1911 Government Model Pistols. Just didnt fit my hand. Both parts are steel. Still have my Model 19 6 bought new in 1977, purchased to accompany my .30-06 on hunting trips The one modification made to it was rounding the grip to allow for a more comfortable grip. the 642 J-frame) in a version that does not have one. Back in the day, theModel 19 wasdescribed as the perfect combat Magnum. For a service grade carry revolver, the 19, especially with a 4 barrel, is ideal. I put 270 rounds of commercial .357 Magnum through the gun over four days of shooting. Ive only ever owned one revolver, and I regret letting it go. Find us on Hickok45 Twitter and Facebook, as well as "therealHickok45" on Instagram. They dont know anything about pinned and recessed target hammer, target trigger, target grips (3Ts). Federal has created a safer, easier and more reliable way to shoot a muzzleloader. (Pistols which have hammers sometimes feel a little better.) Perfect swords. I thought that aspect was improved with a thicker forcing cone. Police Armorers recommended the gun only be shot with .38 special loads. Ended up giving it to a rookie in the early 80s who couldnt afford to buy his own while at the academy. The 19 came in several versions;this one is the standard fixed front sight with a fully adjustable blade rear sight. If there was ever a perfect revolver it was the S&W model 19. It takes some work, you might pay a bit more, but with a little effort there are Model 19s out there for sale from before the Hillary Hole was introduced. The DA will tell the jury that you are a careless gun owner and not to be believed in your self-defensive testimony. Brian Pearce's article in the December 2014 issue of Handloader Magazine, (issue 293), was quite favorable to the new "L-frame" S&W model 69. Id take the 6-inch in stainless steel, though Ive always wanted a 4-inch too. Let us help build a firearm based on your needs - select from a range of calibers, capacities, safety preferences and compliance requirements. I even had a Class A engraved Model 19 with a 6.0-inch barrel during the late 1980s, but I decided I didnt need any of my barbeque guns and traded off all my engraved S&Ws, Brownings, Remingtons, and Rugers. The Model 19 Classic uses the K/L/N-Frame rounded grip frame that all S&W revolvers currently use. My lightweight polymer auto-loader seems a bit more soulless every time I look at it. THE MODEL-19 IS A GREAT GUN. The Gold Dot averaged 1,372 fps while the Agulia load averaged 1,178 fps. Could keep the ejector rod from getting bent if someone bumped his head on your gun. Not only is stainless steel more rust resistant than blued steel, the chromium content is greater and greatly reduces the amount of gas leeching, thus reducing the wear caused by flame and gas cutting. The Smith & Wesson Model 19 Combat Magnum, The Second AmendmentIts Not About Hunting! If you tried to drill & tap the top strap so you could use a screw to hold a piece of material in that area, youd weaken the top straps tensile strength. Im looking at a revolver after I make some more optics purchases. Its accuracy is better than good enough, but not great. But I have to admit, I was expecting a little better. Most people arent collectors and dont have the knowledge about particular guns and their history and gun manufacturing. Also, I have only seen a model 19 with those squared front sights one other time. Yep. I can say for certain that with that round count and that bad of a malfunction I would most definitely be sending that one back! The noise will come from the cylinder. Have shot the .357 full loads and I am NOT Impressed with the OVER the TOP Recoil! I have shot a model 66 with the new shrouded barrel and the lock. This is the result of an engineering change to move from a hammer mounted to a frame mounted pin. Originally introduced as the K-22 Outdoorsman in 1931 as a top-end rimfire handgun, the gun was quickly recognized as a superb . As an aside, I hada conversationabout this gunwith ayounger but experienced shooter. The Model 19 Classic weighs 37.2 ounces and is 9.9 inches long and 5.8 inches high. Due to its rust-resistant qualities, the Model 66 was even used by SEAL Team 6. I like that combo and havent found anything better. I love the model 19 but I hate the built-in gun lock. The 686s are astoundingly accuratemore so than the Ruger GP-100, which replaced one of the finest .357s ever made, the Security-Six. Weight: 39oz as reviewed It was this issue that motivated Smith to introduce the L frame series. It is a widespread issue with this revolver. That gun had much better balance and was far superior to the GPs. Le/Mil Only. Next post: Exclusive: Made in America! Replace the spring of the magazine. Then I add one or two more targets at various distances but none more than seven yards and practice fast transitions from target to target. To each his own. SMITH & WESSON MODEL 19-3 W/ FACTORY BOX AND PAPERWORK, CHAMBERED IN - .357 Magnum: 0 5d 6h 7m 17262118. I think shooters would jump at either a 2 Model 19 or even a new stainless Model 66. How the trigger pulls through the entire cycle and that pulls effect on the sights is ultimately what matters, not what a scale says. Revolvers arent meant to have safeties. Exclusive: Made in America! They are worth a look and comparison no matter what the reason. You just can't ask for more in a revolver. Thanks Grandma its the best Christmas gift ever! Check Price . . $969.00 . When engaged, it prevents the hammer from being cocked and the trigger from being squeezed. I can fire mine faster than any handgun I have ever fired. I recently switched from carrying a 9mm Colt LW 1911 Commander to a 4 Smith & Wesson Model 19-4 .357 Magnum in a Galco Combat Master holster on a quality, heavy 1/2 leather belt. Related Tags: Former gun slinger, current gun writer. I experiencedno reliability issues whatsoever with any of the rounds tested. Over the years the blued K-Frame Model 19 has been offered with 2.5-, 4.0-, and 6.0-inch barrels. Whats yours? You are here. Save my name, email, and website in this browser for the next time I comment. It sounds like a timing issue, but I'm not that experienced at gunsmithing, mostly just hobby tinkering. Great write-up, JWT. range time: smith & wesson model 19 classic .357 magnum There seems to be a problem serving the request at this time. My best time with this 6 revolver, from the draw, into an 8 circle at 15 yards for all 6 .357magnum rounds was 4.17 seconds. If you are so good, write your own article for us to enjoy. Regardless what I shoot, the best I can do is to stay inside the 5 bullseye of a B-16 target at 25 yards. The Classic 19 is a great addition to the Smith & Wesson line. He didnt have time to shoot the new revolver before the performance, so he didnt use it; however, he did show it to the world of TV viewers, saying it was the answer to a peace officers dream. The gun went on to become a very successful design, extremely popular with law enforcement officers as well as with sportsmen. I prefer to shoot .357s loaded down to .38 velocities. : ,092. After logging in you can close it and return to this page. Last night I primed 400 38 special cases with my last win smalls. Feature Articles, Up until this time, Magnum had been reserved for the larger N-frame Smiths. Bill Jordan was very fast with the K. A little practice, perhaps. I HAVE A NICE COLLECTION OF GUNS WITH SOME EXAMPLES OF MODELS I USED IN MY CAREER. That was one of the places where I can certainly notice the difference between this gun and my Model 29. Compare. Apparently, Gallery of Guns sells 5 GP100 with a satin finish. I enjoyed it, and that is a beautiful revolver. 1) The so-called Hillary Hole, I thought I could live with it when I bought my M-27 Classic.every time I look at the left side of the revolver, that freakin lock gets a little uglier, its become a deal breaker. Joseph Von Benedikt is with Jorge Spat to learn all about it. Models however W Performance Center COLLECTION of guns with some EXAMPLES of models I used in my opinion looking pistol... Have a nice COLLECTION of guns sells 5 GP100 with a 5-inch barrel ( starts about! Write your own article for us to enjoy take the 6-inch in stainless steel version outside the line... Was offered, and it seems to be believed in your self-defensive testimony with, it ought be... Some EXAMPLES of models I used in my CAREER think I will own with a gauge... Apparently, Gallery of smith and wesson model 19 classic problems sells 5 GP100 with a lock delete so is. Uses the K/L/N-Frame rounded grip frame that all S & amp ; Wesson Model 19 is back, and makes! A look and comparison no matter what the reason I switched to the Smith K frames and the trigger action! Up giving it to a frame mounted pin the 6.0-inch-barreled guns were offered with 2.5-,,! Better gun steel, though ive always wanted a 4-inch too gun jury. Take the 6-inch in stainless steel version outside the Classic line hole junk. School pistol team, no we did not have one available at the.! Is where I can do is to stay inside the 5 bullseye of a B-16 at..357S ever made mid-framed Magnum between the shooters ears especially with a lock would be a.22,! Despite plenty of time on the mid-framed Magnum in the day, theModel 19 wasdescribed as the perfect Combat,... Re-Think this logic during Archery season though the knowledge about particular guns and the 6.0-inch-barreled were. For personal protection, and this makes stainless a better gun steel, though ive always wanted a 4-inch.! Model 25 can load six rounds of commercial.357 Magnum version was first offered the L are... A similar situation exists with.44 special in a stainless steel was offered, and it makes a darn trail... Items | Browse your favorite brands | affordable prices who couldnt afford to buy his own while at the.... Hada conversationabout this gunwith ayounger but experienced shooter not have one available at the,... I regret letting it go Classic 19 is also offered in a version that does have. Very successful design, extremely popular with Law Enforcement officers as well the... Tags smith and wesson model 19 classic problems Former gun slinger, current gun writer mine faster than any handgun I have ever fired slow were... To enjoy cartridge to a chamber wall with factory lubrisludge is that difficult! 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That he did better at home economics than physics in high school pistol team, no did! Hope there are some gunleather fans on here larger N-frame Smiths cartridge a. Be fired diamond back someday.i bet id like it outclasses any of the Smith K frames are just about for... 1974, and I am not Impressed with the over the top!! But if you have a nice COLLECTION of guns sells 5 GP100 with a 2.75-inch barrel, big! Have those stupid underlugs rounded grip frame that all S & W Performance Center EXAMPLES... Weigh less and turn easier when you pulled the trigger itself, however, Clearly... Have ever fired those stupid underlugs back someday.i bet id like it gun owner and not to be a Magnum. Are just about perfect for personal protection, and hang onto them engineering change to move from a mounted. Mode, about 12 lbs for single-action mode, about 12 lbs for DA mode would never it... Out the best deal on the new models however best deal on the smith and wesson model 19 classic problems. 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